We Are Once Again Asked To Decide Whose Science to Believe

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Wildlife veterinarian Mark Johnson, who says he oversaw the health of wolves during introduction into Yellowstone and Central Idaho, says the wolves were all healthy and the presence of hydatid disease found in over 60% of wild wolves tested this year didn’t come from his treated wolves. He also says reducing the number of wolves in this area will have no effect on the spread of disease.

“Reducing the number of wolves, or density of wolves, will not change the abundance of Echinococcus in any way, shape, or form, because the wolves are not getting it from each other.”

And this of course runs contrary to studies done in Russia where they have dealt with the presence of wolves for centuries. As related to us from Will Graves, author of “Wolves in Russia: Anxiety Through the Ages“:

When and where wolves were almost eliminated in a given research area, (where almost all wolves were killed by each spring and new wolves moved into the controlled area only in the fall) infections of taenia hydatiqena in moose and boar did not occur in more than 30 to 35% of the animals. The rate of infections were 3 to 5 examples in each animal. When and where wolves were not killed in the controlled areas in the spring, and where there were 1 or 2 litters of wolf cubs, the infections in moose and boar of taenia hydatiqena reached 100% and up to 30 to 40 examples of infection (infestation) were in each moose and boar.

To me this certainly sounds like the density of wolves played a very significant role in the spread of infectious diseases.

So now we must decide whether to believe an American wildlife veterinarian whose only experience in dealing with wolf related disease is a one-shot deal during introduction or Russian studies having dealt with wolves in their country for as long as history accounts for it.

Tom Remington

TLM

Posting to the YPTimes.
Paul D

Tom, it used to be, that when you lifted the rock to peer under it, the cockroaches would scurry for darkness, those days are over and they boldly stand there and stair at you saying “ya, what are you going to do about it:.” What ARE WE going to do about it? You’ve seen the facts: when Dr. Geist and Charles Kay are made out to be idiots and or liars by our Fand G departments all over this country by knit wit biologists and personnel, then what real chance do we have? Those two are arguably the top in the world in their fields and yet are ignored and discounted and even severely shunned by peers because it’s about ideology not science or sound management or in a lot of cases in Idaho, absolutely NO management at all. This isn’t about hydatid disease at all, this is about their ideology and to push it, period. They just come out and tell a lie which is quite obvious in this case and the majority of the public believes them. The IDFG has a 3 and a half million dollar annual media budget machine and they use it against the hunting population in Idaho daily. How ironic is it, when the agency that is supposed to be about hunting, fishing and trapping actually abhors us.
T-bone

The answer to the question of whom to believe is simple…. 2 or 3 individuals in a controled enviroment (YNP). or 200,000 hunters putting boot tracks in most of the 3 states….
Most polls deal with a few thousand and they are satisfied, let alone the results of hundreds of thousands almost a 1\4 million. The biologist/scientific??who’s paying the tab, smoke screen is just that $$$$$. Hunters have been chucking wings in barrells filling out success reports for decades and management stratagies have been adjusted according to these survey’s etc. and now when it comes to wolves our reports don’t mean crap. BS…
Jay-M

Fish and game are going to come out with an other concocted reason that deer in western Montana are not here. Mild winter and wet spring must be too much grass. Climate changing every 90 days Damned animals cant figure it out. Shit for brains will not admit what the damned problem is and it is rather obvious to those that venture into the woods. Lots of wolf tracks and no deer tracks, hmm?
Greg Farber

Fish And ?????
T-bone

Jay our mule deer tanked here as well, it took 15 yrs to get the changes made to start recovery, and there wasn’t a wolf track to be found. Get involved and get loud quick, QUALITY mule deer recovery is a slow process.
T-bone

jay I forgot to asked, does montana have a mule deer initiative plan. We have a hard copy plan, so when we attend the scoping meetings we have a hard copy of where we are at and where the F&G has been directed to take us. That hard copy directive is pretty hard to duck. If Mt doesn’t have one i would be happy to forward the Idaho plan as a place to start.
Jay-M

We havent been able to hunt for mule deer does for quite a few years now, Kalispell area. However they are pretty hardy and in the high country still quite a few. Now that white tails are rare i am sure the mule deer will be the next easy prey. What pisses me to the ends is freaking wolves in the eastern part of the state. I am happy to support the ranchers in thier efforts to kill them off. Mule deer herds out on the plains will be screwed.
Lee

Dr. Mark Johnson lives in Bozeman, Montana. In addition to working on the grey wolf retintroduction in the northern Rockies, he also was involved in the Mexican Wolf recovery program. He has offered classes on wolf immobilization and handling at least from 2000 until now.

He is the executive director of Global Wildlife Resources Inc. http://wildliferesources.org/Bio.html
Jay-M

I am not aware of any initiative to address mule deer as of yet, t-bone. Just the growing hatred of the wolves.
Jay-M

Greg, you been out and about making witness to the lack of game too I take it?
T-bone

Jay M if whitetails are in trouble that is a real bad sign, with their ability to adapt, in a even slightly unbalanced enviroment they can usually do ok. What’s the F&G take on this, are they crying drought. With whitetails ability ti adapt, drought is BS
Jay-M

Fish and game pander to whatever audience they address. They tend to defend the “we love wolves” bunch cause they like those federal dollars that pay for wolves existance. Whitetails are in bad shape. I spent eight days hunting the rut, camped in what used to be a good spot for the last 35 years, I saw three bucks and 5 does while in the past I would have seen way more. Wolf tracks on every gated road I walked, but not so deer or elk for that matter. I never saw the wolves making the tracks either.
ar

Nice link, lee. Notice the sun-figure in the upper left hand page? Typical roman jesuit sunburst – as they worship the creation not the creator.
Lee

ar
The sunburst was used by pagans before Christ was born. The jesuits were founded in 1534.
ar

Christ spoke of paganism thru and thru. It’s what he kept the Israelites from and what we are trying to keep you from.
Greg Farber

As usual Lee is in the dark.. Someone is still using that cute little eight pointed Saturnalian Star, or Sunburst, which represents the planet Saturn in reality.. The Black Sun.. ( You’ll never deprogram this 70+ years old mind controlled idiot AR so forget it..)

http://candidconservatives.com/coincidence-hardly-the-jesuits-rule/
Greg Farber

The eight spokes or the double cross represents saturn (the old sun) the nut jobs worshiping Lucy Lucifer think she is the planet Saturn, this nonsense dates back to Nimrod and the nation of Saturnalia, known as Italy today.. The Knights of Malta display this eight pointed Saturn EL cross all over the place, British SIS, the CIA, the Mossad, etc.etc.. Here is your eight points at the Vatican as well.. Scroll down below the videos and see the pics http://candidconservatives.com/know-who-rome-is-and-face-her-finally/ These nut jobs rule this worlds body politic, there is no refuting it.. The Jesuits came along and picked up where the ancients left off, same sunburst, same double cross, same Babylonian filth.. Amazing isn’t it, it is a ” Double Cross. ” Humanity has been double crossed by a Fallen One.. Lucy.
ar

It’s why our Marked Johnson is not so clever and why so not so clevers believe Mark.
Barry

Who’s science to believe?………
Well, when we break down the facts it seems rather obvious.

The so called experts in the wolf program here have been wrong on EVERY ‘estimate’ they made, every outcome they predicted has also been wrong. At some point with a track record like that, your position as ‘expert’ has to be questioned, if not flatly removed. It was proven that worming these wolves wasn’t 100% successful, yet we have a DVM claiming otherwise, yet we see this tapeworm in a vast majority of wolves.

or

We can look at the Russian studies, that predicted with chilling accuracy what we are seeing 15 years later, including this tapeworm. Even though it was and still is scoffed at by those other ‘experts’.

Geeze, I was born at night…but it wasn’t last night.

We Are Once Again Asked To Decide Whose Science to Believe

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