Me and my first Crossbow

In what had to be one of the most ridiculous laws on the book requiring anyone purchasing a crossbow in the state of North Carolina use to be required to obtain a pistol permit first. So last year when crossbows became legal to use during archery season a number of people crossed stateliness to purchase crossbows and avoid the extra expense and hassle of getting a pistol permit.

The N.C. Wildlife Resources Commission is advising hunters that a bill removing the requirement to obtain a pistol permit in order to purchase or transfer ownership of a crossbow has been signed into law.
Previously, state law required anyone buying or otherwise receiving a crossbow in North Carolina to have either a pistol permit from their local sheriff’s office or a concealed handgun permit.
Crossbows are a legal method of hunting in North Carolina, permissible anytime bow-and-arrow hunting is allowed. However, the N.C. Wildlife Resources Commission does not regulate the sale or purchase of firearms and crossbows.

NCWRC

They should do away with Pistol Permits altogether but that’s another conversation.

The Big Buck Expo returns to Greensboro this weekend, July 23-25. I believe this is the third year they have held this show in Greensboro in 2008 the turnout was dismal last year was a bit better but and that is a big but they had the Bone Collector Crew. Michael Waddle can draw a crowd so it will be interesting to see what happens this year without any big names in the hunting industry slated to be there.

Backwoods Life is who they have and once again it’s a hunting show that I’m not at all familiar with. I guess they are on the Pursuit Channel as well.

I did get an email today from the organizers saying that all the major crossbow manufactures will be there so people can get crossbows for the upcoming season. This is the first outdoor show in the state since the crossbow has been added as approved archery equipment for hunting by all hunters. If you plan to buy one make sure you have a pistol permit issued by your local sheriff in order to legally purchase one. ( A ridiculous law that needs to be overturned)

I got scheduling conflicts so I highly doubt I’ll make this year’s show. I’d be interested to hear any of my readers review of this show if they get out there this weekend.

With the recent legalization of crossbows as archery equipment in North Carolina I suspect there are a few folks besides me looking at them. Cabela’s has a basic buyers guide that is a good starting point to at least get your thinking about some of the options.

Now even though the crossbow is a legal weapon to hunt with the NC State Law requiring a pistol permit to purchase one is still in effect. That also means that you can’t order one on line so your only option is to purchase it from a bricks and mortar store. There is no restriction that I’m aware of to prevent you from purchasing it in another state and bringing it back to North Carolina. Matter of fact I’ve talked with a number of folks that plan to do exactly that.
This has got to be one of the oddest laws on the book because there is no way that a crossbow and a handgun are even closely related.

I’ve never even shot a crossbow so this is an entirely new thing for me. My plan at this point is to find a store that has a range that I can test fire the weapons. My concern from talking to a number of folks is the noise associated with shooting the bolt. Obviously much like a noisy bow a deer could jump the string on a loud crossbow. I hopefully will have the opportunity to shoot a couple of different brands to get a feel for them prior to purchasing one.
In a perfect world I’d get a couple to test out and see how they do in hunting conditions especially with the new market for them here in North Carolina. I guess I can dream.

• Require persons harvesting deer through the Deer Management Assistance Program to use tags provided by the Commission and report their harvests, whether those deer are antlerless or antlered. Allow harvest of deer on DMAP areas under the big game harvest report card and the bonus antlerless deer harvest report card, where applicable.
• Change the description of where bonus antlerless deer harvest report cards may be used from “private lands” to “lands other than those enrolled in the Commission’s Game Land Program” in order to permit the use of these cards on military installations, national wildlife refuges, and other public lands that are NOT game lands.
• Remove the daily bag limit for deer.
• Allow hunters to use archery equipment to harvest deer during the muzzleloading firearms season on game lands.
• Shorten the bow season by one week and open the muzzleloader season one week earlier to create a two week muzzleloader season.
• Deer seasons in the Northwestern deer season will be changed so that the regular gun season is extended through January 1. Deer seasons in the Eastern, Central, and Western deer season structures will remain unchanged.
• Deer seasons on game lands in the Northwestern deer season will be changed so that the regular gun season is extended through January 1. Deer seasons on game lands in the Eastern, Central, and Western deer season structures will remain unchanged.
• Open all private lands in the Eastern, Central, and Northwestern deer seasons to the maximum either-sex deer season.
• Assign all of Moore County to the Eastern deer season.
• Allow falconry on Sundays, except for migratory game birds.
• Allow bow hunting on Sundays on private lands only, except for migratory game birds.
• Allow the use of crossbows anytime bow and arrows are legal weapons.
• Disallow the selling of live foxes and coyotes taken under a depredation permit to controlled hunting preserves.
• Allow a landowner with a valid depredation permit to give away the edible portions of deer to anyone. Require the recipient to retain a copy of the depredation permit.
• Eliminate the requirement that a landholder must get a U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service permit for the taking of migratory birds before getting a Commission permit to do so.

This is great news for all of us who supported these changes but let’s remember there were a number of sportsmen for whatever reason opposed these rules. I hope that we can move on and find our common ground and mend fences because I’m sure there will be attacks on our traditions by anti hunting groups.

Uncle Ted responding to PA News in regards to debate over crossbows there.

I urge you to contact your State Lawmakers to defeat the crossbow bills, the bills to eliminate the second week of muzzleloader season, and the bills to disallow bow hunting on Sundays. All of these were passed by the NCWRC and now special interest groups like the NCBA have sought to thwart the public hearing and the Wildlife Commission process.

Ten Point is the brand I'm leaning towards once we get the crossbow included in the archery season.

Anyone that has followed the crossbow debate over the years in North Carolina has certainly been aware of the NCBA (NC Bow hunters Association) total opposition for the crossbow being allowed as a legal hunting weapon except for in the case you are handicap. That is an across the board opposition including firearm season. Here is an excerpt from NCBA website on the policy on crossbows;

The NCBA’s basic position on crossbows has not changed. NCBA opposes blanket, “Across the board” legalization of crossbows for hunting in North Carolina AT ANY TIME, except as allowed by state law for legally handicapped persons who possess the “handicapped hunting permit” from the North Carolina Wildlife Resources Commission. The phrase, “AT ANY TIME”, means just that! NCBA is opposed to legalization of crossbows for hunting purposes during all hunting seasons, except as provided by law for legitimatly handicapped persons.

Not only do the oppose it but if you’re a member of the NCBA you cannot in anyway openly oppose this stance.

“Members may not endorse such a weapon under any circumstances.” Endorsing crossbows, or any such a weapon, means that NCBA members who openly profess the legalization of crossbows “at any time” , during any hunting seasons, are in violation of this Bylaw. And, as the Bylaw continues to state, “If a member is caught using or endorsing such a weapon in violation of this article, he/she will be subject to immediate dismissal from NCBA membership.”
Endorsing a crossbow for hunting purposes in North Carolina may be done in a variety of ways. The most common ways are to publish a statement in favor of legalizing crossbows via any media source, such as publishing a statement in a magazine, newspaper, letter, email, internet forum or chat-room; or by talking to a group of people, or individuals, in public or casual conversation. A member may have a personal opinion that differs from NCBA’s position, and they have an absolute right to that. But, if he/she openly or publicly endorses the crossbow, or similar weapon, under any circumstances, the member is in violation of this Bylaw, and appropriate action will be taken by the Executive Council to enforce this Bylaw.

To me that is pretty clear they oppose crossbows and they don’t want them allowed as legal hunting weapons here in NC. They have every right as an organization to take that stance and that is why I and a number of other folks have left their organization.
I guess their most recent legislative update is a bit curious;

We believe our bills are fair to all involved and offer a good balance and compromise that everyone can live with. Not everyone is going to be totally satisfied with everything that comes of this process. But, we must try and do our best to convince our legislators to support our bills. We are hopeful that our Wildlife Commission and Commissioners will see and understand that we are not asking for anything that is unreasonable. In fact, we are not asking for anything except to keep our deer seasons in place as they now exist. The only exception is to allow the use of crossbows during firearms seasons.

Sounds like an endorsement of the crossbow.

The legalization of the crossbow is coming one only needs to look at the trends across the country. Every year more and more states recognize the crossbow as archery equipment. At a time where many traditional places to hunt are being urbanized the importance of controlling burgeoning wildlife populations such as deer in these areas is an issue. Archery equipment including the crossbow is a legitimate close range weapon to hunt these animals while avoiding the safety issues with the use of firearms.
If the NCBA is successful at getting this law through the use of the crossbow in archery only zones on Game Lands as well as the urban deer season will be off limits. The crossbow has the effective range comparable to a bow not a gun. The crossbow shoots a bolt that flies and looks more like an arrow and not a bullet. There is no legitimate reason as to why the crossbow is not a legitimate archery weapon to hunt with in NC.
The NCBA has to realize they are fighting a losing battle when in the public meetings their position was overwhelmingly rejected by the sportsmen of the state. I guess that may be why they are violating their own organizations rule on endorsing the crossbow by having a bill introduced to allow it during the firearm season.
I urge you to contact your state lawmakers and ask them to reject this special interest bill and leave the power of managing the wildlife with the NCWRC.

photo by Moose

This past week I went to one of the NCWRC public meetings about the new hunting proposals which I covered in an earlier story. After the proposals for this year were covered they opened the floor up to the public and it gives you a pretty good idea what is on the mind of folks and what could potentially be topics for proposals in future years. You also have to take some of this with a grain of salt because it is easy for a group to organize and have members speak out looking like it is a ground swell

A lot of the public comments were a rehash of proposals that passed last year and were held up before being implemented.

Crossbows
A number of people who identified themselves as bow hunters spoke out against allowing crossbows. To hear these guys talk you’d think that thousands upon thousands of people across the state will pick up crossbows flooding the land with hunters ruining everyone’s experience. I seriously doubt it where most hunters hunt private land anyways how can that impact hunters on neighboring lands? It won’t

Muzzleloading
Adding a second week of Muzzleloader was another delayed proposal that many of the bow hunters opposed. On this many bow hunters requested that this week be tagged on in January after the regular firearm rather than prior to firearm season. My view the public spoke on this last year and it passed with overwhelming support. I see no reason to move it. I agree with a small game hunter who spoke up requesting that the NCWRC not impose any more on their hunting.

Quality Deer Management (QDM)
This is one topic that is not in any of the proposals being held up nor any of the new proposals. There was a number of requests that the NCWRC take a serious look at earn a buck program (hunter would need to kill a doe prior to getting a first or second buck tag) and a few requests for a antler point restriction. I believe this will be a big topic over the next few years as some hunters look to the state to increase trophy opportunities.

Outdoors man need to be involved in shaping the future so please attend one of the public meetings or fill out an electronic form on line.

The other proposal NCBA opposes is the legalization of crossbows across the board for anyone who wants to use them. We specially oppose them being legalized during ‘Bow Only’ seasons for anyone other than those who qualify for the handicapped hunting permit to use them. This is why this state law was enacted some 12-15 years ago.. to give the handicapped and physically challenged hunters a “special” privilege and the opportunity and advantage to hunt during bow seasons. Adoption of this proposal will eliminate the need for the special handicapped license/permits, and it will also eliminate the only advantage and privilege

NCBA Crossbow Facts & Fiction

Most of the folks I’ve met over the years that have a handicap did not necessarily want an “advantage” over those who don’t have a handicap just an opportunity to participate. Nor do I believe that the crossbow is an advantage over the modern compound bow.
Opposition to the crossbow by the NCBA is certainly their right as an organization even though I don’t understand the demonization of this weapon.

The N.C.B.A. will not permit its members to use this type of weapon (Crossbows or “Draw-Lock” devices), to hunt legal game, unless the member is legitimately physically disabled.
Members may not endorse such a weapon under any circumstances. If a member is caught using or endorsing such a weapon in violation of this article, he/she will be subject to immediate dismissal from N.C.B.A. membership.

NCBA

Opposing its use during the archery season is one thing but to oppose its use ever even during firearm season seems to be a bit extreme. In states that have legalized the use of a crossbow there has not been a significant loss of bow hunters. I think one could make the argument that more folks leave the bow hunting ranks and use firearms rather then switch to crossbows. However NCBA will drum a member out who uses a crossbow but has no such rule for firearms.
I don’t see anything wrong with a crossbow and if it brings more folks into the hunting ranks I think it is a good thing. So instead of getting kicked out I decided that I just would not renew my membership.
The NCBA is a great organization and does a lot of good things but their don’t ask don’t tell stand on crossbows is just one I can’t live with.

I was pleased to have Ramon Bell from the NCBA as a guest poster on here earlier this week. I appreciate his willingness to address the issues and clarify the Association’s position. The NCBA is certainly a prominent sportsman organization here in the state and have supported and advocated for our sport over the years. While I agree with them on many issues there is a few I fundamentally don’t agree.

Opposition to 2nd Week of Muzzleloader Season

The one that is most important to NCBA is the opening of gun (muzzle loader) season one week earlier statewide. Not so much that it encroaches on the ‘bow only’ seasons statewide by another week, it does. But because we feel this is not in the best interests of the quality of the buck deer population and the quality of deer hunting in general for all of North Carolina.

I don’t know about anyone else but I was surprised at this statement because the message I heard at the public hearing I went to was that adding this week on would only make the bucks go nocturnal earlier reducing the opportunity for bow hunters. I’m certain that there message of Quality Deer Management and improving the Buck population was missed by a lot of the hunters in attendance at the public meetings and not just me. I’m not convinced that the way to go about improving the maturity of bucks in NC is by season lengths but rather by bag limits and other regulatory measures. I’m not advocating for that and that is really another whole topic (QDM, Antler Restrictions, and Earn a Buck programs) that we’ll certainly get into in the future.
In the past archery equipment was not allowed during the muzzleloader season but that has been corrected and basically you can bow hunt from opening day in September all the way till the closing day on January 1st. The majority of hunting takes place on private land so individuals and clubs can easily control hunting methods, antler restrictions, doe harvesting etc. Everything one could want except controlling how your neighbors hunt.

We (NCBA) also believe there are other ‘Safety’ and ‘Social’ factors for why any gun season for deer should not be opened earlier. From a ‘Safety’ standpoint, we feel it will be dangerous, not only for hunters and bowhunters in particular! It will be dangerous to others who will be using the woods at this time of year.. late October.. when leaves are still on trees and in full fall colors to boot. This foliage will not only restrict vision and line of sight for hunters and make for dangerous shooting situations, our ‘blaze orange’ hats and vests will blend in with the fall colors complicating already dangerous situations. From a ‘Social’ standpoint, there could be many more unwanted and unnecessary confrontations and conflicts between hunters and others who will be in the outdoors during this time engaging in a variety of other outdoor activities such as hiking, camping, biking, horseback riding, animal/bird watching.. and just sightseeing in general to take in the fall colors.

Safety while handling any weapon is important safe gun handling is especially important. I fully support and advocate people follow the rules when it comes to guns. Identifying your target is paramount whether it is an arrow, bolt, or bullet you are releasing. Hunting is a safe sport especially compared to other recreational activities like softball, soccer, and football. The vast majority of serious and fatal accidents in hunting are from falls. There are a number of firearm hunting opportunities that take place prior to killing frosts while foliage is still present. There does not seem to be an increase in accidental shootings because of it. I believe that this argument supports an unfounded stereotype against hunters in general and I would have hoped that the NCBA would not engage in promoting such a stereotype.
How this proposal came to be is not that important because it obviously had wide support at the public meetings. There are many gun hunters that support QDM practices but the majority of them did not appear to support this argument at least in the public meeting forums I attended. I honestly believe that if people feel strongly about improving the age of bucks in this state that there are better ways to go about it then season structure. I’d be curious to know the age structure of bucks taken by bow as to those taken by gun. Anecdotally in conversations I have with hunters that hunt all methods it seems that when they have a bow in the hand they are more apt to take a smaller buck then if they were gun hunting they’d pass it up. I got two buck tags for where I hunt whether I take them in October, November, or December I don’t think will matter.
Part 2 will look at the Crossbow Issue and I elaborate a bit on why I did not renew my membership.